Author Topic: Proflex 2000 first impression; need suggestions needed for all mountain riding. (Read 6458 times)

Akagi · « **on:** May 19, 2009, 01:22:41 am »

The bike is basically a NOS 757, but has a carbon swingarm upgrade.

After a year of first getting the bike, I have finally found the time and people to ride with. I found out quickly that the terrain here is very nasty here in Kelowna, Canada (I am only here for school). Very rocky, very dry, very loose, very nasty when you fall. Even the plants here hurt because they all have thorns... I am used to the flat forgiving nutrient rich soft soils in the province of Ontario.

Here are my first impressions:

The bike climbs great (despite the stock tires). I am incredibly out of shape, but I was able to keep up with the "B" group right off the bat, without having excercised in almost half a year. A lot of people riding longer travel super heavy looking All Mountain rigs with 2.25 tires. I think that when my IRC Mibro 2.1s arrive and a few more weeks, I should be able to outclimb most of them. The panaracer duster II really suck in my conditions, I wonder why they would put a specific (muddish) tire stock on so many proflex bikes.

For the Downhill, I had problems. I was able to keep up with the group while descending but I felt like I was almost on the edge of being out of control. I don't think it was really the suspensions fault. The rear suspension worked wonders while the Crosslink felt a bit harsh; I think the spring is a bit heavy for me. The Panaracer Dusters made me feel really unconfident about myself as I would slide laterally into ruts and other things. I felt like I couldnt steer where I wanted to, and the bike went where it wanted to go, all of this is at a decent speed too, it wasn't like I was locking the brakes.

The terrain was also very steep, and I found myself behind the saddle for a lot of it. Is this normal? I figure if I want to be one of the faster people I would need to stay on my saddle and pedal. There were times that I stayed on the saddle so I could pedal but something would end up suprising me and I would end up going over the handlebars. What can I do to improve descending while avoiding bailing over my handlebars?

craiga · « **Reply #1 on:** May 19, 2009, 05:09:42 am »

After I started going over the handle bars going up hill, I thought I'd best sort this out.

That was when I changed my elastomers on my XP-X & got the COR Spring upgrade. There is also a riding technique I read about which basically has your arms, hands, Shoulders, wrists as loose as possible to absorb shocks, and not tense which results in you leaving the bike.

You've mentioned your spring & tyres - google for the technique, but basically the modern bikes are going to have more travel & on certain runs will have an advantage, but you're on a great bike so who cares!

Colin · « **Reply #2 on:** May 19, 2009, 08:05:25 am »

How tall are you and what do you weigh?
Forgive the personal Q's but it's just to judge how suitable that bike is for you, You're aware that it is a Small aren't you?

What weight springs are on the shocks ( it should say on them if they're still "as new")

Looking at the height of that saddle, you must be reasonably tall and so you have a relative "ar$e up" angle to the handlebars so I expect you're always going to feel as if you are going over the handlebars even when you don't actually.....................<GRIN>

Yes, interesting that a 2000 has a carbon swing-arm, they had the Ally one as standard I'm pretty sure.

Tyre choice is very important for confidence so, yes, go with something that inspires you!

Downhill speed may just come with experience and confidence, so keep at it! <GRIN>

Col.

jeffhop · « **Reply #3 on:** May 19, 2009, 08:17:33 am »

at the risk of being hung drawn and quartered it sounds like the best thing you can do is get yourself a modern fork with about 100-120mm travel as youve got the j path blues, also if youve got one of those silly tiller length original stems swap it out for something no longer than 90mm, keep the crosslink so you can refit it when you get back to your smoother trails. im now going to run off and hide where no one can find me

shovelon · « **Reply #4 on:** May 19, 2009, 01:36:00 pm »

Quote from: jeffhop on May 19, 2009, 08:17:33 am

at the risk of being hung drawn and quartered it sounds like the best thing you can do is get yourself a modern fork with about 100-120mm travel as youve got the j path blues, also if youve got one of those silly tiller length original stems swap it out for something no longer than 90mm, keep the crosslink so you can refit it when you get back to your smoother trails. im now going to run off and hide where no one can find me

Jeff beat me to it. I had a tendency to fell like I would be pitched over the bars. The J-path would tuck the front wheel under and dive. The noleen shocks are over damped for me too, which is why it felt harsh. I went with a slider fork of 100 mm travel, actually a Noleen mega air.

For fire roads and fast sweeps I like my crosslinks, but heavy braking was terrifying.

Akagi · « **Reply #5 on:** May 20, 2009, 01:15:25 am »

Thanks for the quick reply guys.

I just got back from a ride and took a pic I took today. This is the accurate seat post height I ride at now after i got the LBS to chop it down.

I am 5'7, and weight 130 pounds. Rear shock has a 250 lb spring, front has a 200 lb spring; which explains it... I should be riding a 175 lb up front. According to the spring charts, the SMALL MODEL of the x57 came with a 130-170 rider weight spring for the rear, but a 160-200 rider weight spring for the front! What could possibly be the reason for such a missmatch ?!?! I am considering a shorter stem, but I think i will need to ride more to decide, as the bike might be too cramped with a shorter stem than I have; or perhaps not cramped, but more modern position? Anyways, it is a 110mm with 5deg rise.

I think I am going to stick with the crosslink as long as I can. This is still so much more bike than I am rider. I am going to see how much I can get out of this platform. Thinking... If i mated a Fox RP2 to the front shock, the 8.5inch e2e one, it could make it a little more nose up, add more travel, and lighten it at the same time.. And probably introduce even more J-Path woes.

But for now, 175lb spring is the first priority.

jeffhop · « **Reply #6 on:** May 20, 2009, 02:10:30 am »

if you put a lighter spring on the front than whats on now then the over the bars feeling will be exaggerated as there will be a bit more sag meaning a slightly steeper head angle also when you brake downhill the lighter spring will compress quicker and further than the current one leading to more comedy over the bars antics.

purple gerbil · « **Reply #7 on:** May 20, 2009, 12:15:30 pm »

try turning the top pivot to alter the j-path.. although this will make it more sensitive to smaller bump's and will increase the pogo effect!!
check that your rear shock is properly damped as this could be throwing you over the bar's and the forks may not be to blame!

Akagi · « **Reply #8 on:** May 21, 2009, 04:22:13 pm »

Quote from: purple gerbil on May 20, 2009, 12:15:30 pm

try turning the top pivot to alter the j-path.. although this will make it more sensitive to smaller bump's and will increase the pogo effect!!
check that your rear shock is properly damped as this could be throwing you over the bar's and the forks may not be to blame!

I can do that? I don't understand, can you be more specific or point me to a howto?

shovelon · « **Reply #9 on:** May 21, 2009, 04:28:23 pm »

Hold the phone. Those are Crosslinks. I thought only Vectors had adjustable pivots. I will check my crosslinks tonight.

purple gerbil · « **Reply #10 on:** May 22, 2009, 02:09:08 am »

oops!! as shovelon say's vectors did it but unsure about crosslinks come to think off it(DOH!!)..
top pivot on the fork leg could be rotated to alter path of travel i.e j-path or more of a straiight up action..
face the front of the fork and check to see if the top pivot has a hole in it..
if so one side will be a plain hole & the other side will be counter sunk....
loosening the top bolts on the fork legs allows the pivot to be turned to the desired travel path....

Colin · « **Reply #11 on:** May 22, 2009, 05:05:06 am »

Correct! Vector's DO, Crosslink's DON'T

Vectors have an adjustable J-Path movement because of an eccentrically centred Upper Pivot Axle Rod.
There is no mention of this facility in the Crosslink Manual.
Neither the upper or lower Pivot Axle rods are eccentrically centred on the Crosslink.
and there is no central access point on the Upper Link Assembly to pivot it anyway (the small grub screw on it is a Grease Port).

Your Suspension Tuning adjustments are:

Spring Rate:
Rider Weight (lbs) Spring Rate
up to 140 175
130-170 200
160-200 200
190-230 225
over 230 250

Suspension Sag:
20% of the total shock shaft stroke, or 20% of the total wheel travel
Cross-Link forks have a total shock shaft travel of 52mm which yields a total wheel travel of 76mm
suggested sag for the Cross-Link is 10mm at the shock, or 15mm at the wheel.

Preload:
Used to set the correct Sag.
NOTE: Never increase the preload on a spring past 5 full turns of the preload adjuster. If you have tightened the preload adjuster
over five full turns and are still getting too much sag, move up to the next spring rate.

Damping:
The damping on the Cross-Link EXP is not externally adjustable. This fork uses a Noleen NR-1. The NR-1 has a preset amount of rebound and compression damping which is set at the factory.
The damping on the Cross-Link CS, C and ELT is externally adjustable. These forks use Noleen NR-2 or NR-5 "Smart" shocks, The damping adjuster knob on Noleen NR-2 and Smart Shock mainly adjust rebound damping while affecting compression damping only slightly.

Col

rapiddescent · « **Reply #12 on:** May 23, 2009, 12:55:58 am »

I've not ridden in california (yet!) so its difficult to work out what your trails are like - for me, in Scotland, 'All Mountain' riding is all we have and normal rides for me tend to average about 25 miles with 1500m of climb. The trails tend to be on hills between 100m (300ft) and 400m (1200ft) high. Our weather conditions are also much more variable and we frequently ride in rain and mud. In Scotland we have 12 different words for mountain biking mud. Trails round here are a mixture of man made but the majority are open country and very rough with rocks and other natural hazards.

our bikes tend to be a bit heavier than normal, have fatter tyres (2.25 to 2.35), slightly more laid back geometry with longer travel front forks, large disk brakes (most of our club use XT now), a few riders are using Crank Bros Joplin seat posts and a lot of riders have single pivot suspension because multi-pivots just don't last in our weather conditions.

so, to make your bike a bit more all mountain, I would:

ditch the cross links for a set of 120mm travel Revs or Fox
use a bigger tyre - these look dangerous for DH sections!
use a riser bar - they are more comfy and better for control

callum
rds

orange · « **Reply #13 on:** May 23, 2009, 05:20:36 am »

Quote

In Scotland we have 12 different words for mountain biking mud

go on then - what are they?

rapiddescent · « **Reply #14 on:** May 23, 2009, 09:53:27 am »

we also have 23 types of rain, but one description for a good day "sort of sunny, 16'C".

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Author Topic: Proflex 2000 first impression; need suggestions needed for all mountain riding. (Read 6458 times)