Author Topic: Rear shock help (Read 7083 times)

colinv · « **on:** March 30, 2008, 12:43:38 pm »

What is a fairly decent rear shock to replace my stock rear one? My bike is a K2 4500.

shovelon · « **Reply #1 on:** March 30, 2008, 05:09:22 pm »

Quote from: colinv on March 30, 2008, 12:43:38 pm

What is a fairly decent rear shock to replace my stock rear one? My bike is a K2 4500.

I have liked the Swinger shocks. I have them on my 957 and Oz, starting with the coil, then graduating to air sprung. The addition of a little platform damping to the high pivot geometry is the defining factor in this design. Couped with Simon's sealed bearing conversion, you can set a wide array of damping characteristics. For instance with the standard bushes, I was using 50 psi in the SPV chamber, and 100 in the spring chamber. After the sealed bearing conversion, the action was noticably quicker, so I took 10 psi out of the spring chamber, and put 20 psi in the SPV chamber to compensate the decrease in bushing stiction and drag.

The basic swinger weight is approx 270 grams. I could easily carry a spare shock with me and a shock pump, and still come out lighter than the NR4. The Swinger 4 way coil came in at 1000 grams.

But it was a revelation in damping.

Terry

skoddy · « **Reply #2 on:** March 30, 2008, 06:15:14 pm »

+1 on the Manitou Swinger. I used the big 6-way coil-over jobby, and had to trim material from the lower (swing arm end) mount, but not anywhere near enough for concern.

Luke · « **Reply #3 on:** March 31, 2008, 04:46:14 am »

OK, every time something goes dicky on my NR4 I start looking on the bay for appropriate shocks, and then never get round to replacing it (Big thanks to Wylyman for his old NR4)
The question O keep on asking is about compressed length;
If the shock is longer you can just set more sag, but even the 215mm Swingers have a closed length of around 150mm,

On my 5500 the swingarm hits the frame at 158mm!

So what have you guys done make sure that doesn't happen?

Simon, do you happen to have any sealed bearing kits left over?
The bushings seem to last a good long time, but when the time comes to replace them I'll be in trouble.

Cheers,
luke

Colin · « **Reply #4 on:** March 31, 2008, 05:51:31 am »

Quote from: Luke on March 31, 2008, 04:46:14 am

Simon, do you happen to have any sealed bearing kits left over?
The bushings seem to last a good long time, but when the time comes to replace them I'll be in trouble.

Hi,
I imported some pivot kits from Iron Horse in the US for us Europeans and have just a few pivot kits left for the x56 style bikes (RK002) and the 4000/4500/5000/5500/Oz bikes (RK008), {and one X-Link seal kit (RK004).

The costs are:
RK002 £15
RK008 £8
RK004 £8

P&P is £3 to Europe.
£1 extra if payment by Paypal please.

email/IM me if you want any.

Regards
Col.

Simon · « **Reply #5 on:** March 31, 2008, 02:43:37 pm »

Quote from: Luke on March 31, 2008, 04:46:14 am

simon, do you happen to have any sealed bearing kits left over?

Cheers,
luke

I don't have any kits though I do have a brand new swingarm already reamed out and ready to go.
I can supply full fitting and removal instruction.
I can supply engineering drawings for the pivot shaft and shims so you can get them made.
I can supply bearing numbers and bolt sizes.
Unfortunatly I've lost my engineer who made my parts.

If your happy with your bikes performance then replacement bushes are the best way to go, if your looking for improving performance then a bit of effort will be required.

Simon.

shovelon · « **Reply #6 on:** March 31, 2008, 03:37:54 pm »

Quote from: Luke on March 31, 2008, 04:46:14 am

OK, every time something goes dicky on my NR4 I start looking on the bay for appropriate shocks, and then never get round to replacing it (Big thanks to Wylyman for his old NR4)
The question O keep on asking is about compressed length;
If the shock is longer you can just set more sag, but even the 215mm Swingers have a closed length of around 150mm,

On my 5500 the swingarm hits the frame at 158mm!

So what have you guys done make sure that doesn't happen?

Simon, do you happen to have any sealed bearing kits left over?
The bushings seem to last a good long time, but when the time comes to replace them I'll be in trouble.

Cheers,
luke

Mount the shock, and see if it hits. Starting with a 190 x 50mm (7.5 i2i x 2")travel Swinger, I use an adapter block to gain the 215mm i2i. Mine did not have a problem. Less than $100 if I remember correctly.

I since upgraded to a 200mm x 24mm (7 .875 x 2.25" )travel Swinger, and used same block, and still did not hit. $75 at Santa Cruz liquidation. Gives me right about 150mm (6")travel at rear.

So depends what travel fork you want to use. If 150 mm fork, I would grab 8.5 i2i x 2.5 inch travel shock. Will work fine.

Terry

Colin · « **Reply #7 on:** April 01, 2008, 07:56:21 am »

Terry,
Did you have to mod the upper shock mount at all on the Oz?
I also have a Swinger (210 x 50) and I think I will do the same mod adaptor as you but probably at the top end of the shock, any reasons why not?
What's your adaptor made from, machined Ally?

Col.

shovelon · « **Reply #8 on:** April 01, 2008, 08:20:06 am »

Quote from: Colin on April 01, 2008, 07:56:21 am

Terry,
Did you have to mod the upper shock mount at all on the Oz?
I also have a Swinger (210 x 50) and I think I will do the same mod adaptor as you but probably at the top end of the shock, any reasons why not?
What's your adaptor made from, machined Ally?

Col.

I did not have to modify upper mount at all. I did find that the seam on my frame protruded out more that I liked, so I shaved off 1 mm for clearance on the tapered part of the shock body. It has been fine.

The adapter is machined from alum, with 2 teflon washers at the swingarm, and an alum bushing inside the shock eye.

You could put an adapter at the top instead of the bottom. I have never seen a 210mm swinger, which would be the same length as a Noleen. Do you really need to lenthen the shock?

Terry

colinv · « **Reply #9 on:** April 03, 2008, 09:41:43 pm »

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=250231821663&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=015

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=320233163005&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=011

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=120241671381&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=002

Which from the above is best suited to the 4500 frame?
Cheers

Matno · « **Reply #10 on:** April 03, 2008, 10:05:05 pm »

I'd have to say that an air shock is a perfect match - much lighter and plenty versatile for a carbon frame. However, both of the Swinger 4-ways you have listed there are way too short at 190mm eye to eye. You should try to stick to the original length of about 210mm. That 6-way at 215mm would probably work fine, but it's probably quite a bit heavier than the air, and I'm not sure about the frame clearance.

I've loved my Swinger 3-way on my 5000. Great ride quality and pretty durable so far. (I ride pretty rough trails with lots of drops - just got home from a fantastic two hour singletrack ride!) Mine's a 210mm eye to eye though, which is perfect. Used to have a slightly shorter shock (200mm) and the difference in BB height and ride quality was noticeable (more slack geometry, lower center of gravity). If you went slightly longer, you could just adjust the sag to make up for it...

Matt

jeffhop · « **Reply #11 on:** April 04, 2008, 03:50:44 am »

im running a 190/50mm x-fusion o2r on my oz and dont have any issues with it at all.

4500_rider · « **Reply #12 on:** April 04, 2008, 03:59:57 pm »

I may get shot for suggesting this but.... 5th Element Air.... I've one on my 4500 and think its great, then again i've not had any of the problems some people have had with them.

Its a bit of a "luck of the draw" shock... you may get a good one, you may get a bad one. Plus... Progressive are no longer in the mtb suspension market and as far as I know wont service any of there mtb shocks, no idea what the parts situation is cause i've not needed anything.

What about a Risse?

shovelon · « **Reply #13 on:** April 04, 2008, 09:03:24 pm »

Risse is an option, in fact I may use one on the rear of a project coming up. The initial seal stiction mimics threshold valving somewhat.You guys across the pond will have a hard time with rebuilds. Kind of pricy to ship to California. Too bad that dealer closed his shop(CVI?).

The Manitou has a huge dealer network, and is very reliable. You can get them cheap, and the SPV is almost a perfect match for the Evo/worldcup/x57 semi-active suspension geometry. 50 to 70 psi in the platform chamber is magical.

5th element started it all, but again I can't say there is any support over the pond. Hippi suspension works over in the states does progressive now, so we have a source. What about Push industries over there?

Terry ( Work, ride, sleep? Decisions, decisions.)

IMO · « **Reply #14 on:** April 04, 2008, 11:54:51 pm »

Dont beleive the weight of that swinger 6 way. It will be nearer 900 - 950 gm's with a strong steel spring. Thats why I'm looking at an air shock too. Beware though ,oversize air shocks, like the RS Pearl do not fit into our frames.
Keep your mits off that DHX5 thats on the bay too, Ive got my eye on it!

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Author Topic: Rear shock help (Read 7083 times)