Author Topic: x57 versus Attack (Read 4995 times)

Frankd3000 · « **on:** December 03, 2005, 11:54:02 am »

Okay, so the next step in my posting the "versus" line is this.

I've been wondering about how the Attack (and Lithium, which I simply can't afford [smiley=worry.gif] ) would compare to Frank's high/forward pivot.

I've totally ditched the idea of building the Large 5000 frame I have. I'm quite sure it'll be pretty much the same thing.

The Attack, however, I can find a frame only, for a "decent price".

So, as the title says, does the Attack's lower, behind-the-BB pivot make a really big difference? Climbing, cruising, pedal-induced bob, etc.

PATIA!

p.s. - spam - if anyone has a Large Attack frame they wanna get rid of I.M. me.

Matno · « **Reply #1 on:** December 03, 2005, 05:20:13 pm »

Hard to compare the Attack to other frames because it only comes with crappy suspension, and not a lot of people have upgraded that one. I've ridden a Way Big, and it was heavy, the suspension sucked, but the handling was pretty smooth (maybe just because I felt like I was so high in the air...)

Which frame do you think the 5000 will be "pretty much the same thing" as? Certainly not one of the "strut" frames. BIG difference. The 5000 handles longer travel better, but probably doesn't climb as well (certainly not with a taller fork, but that doesn't mean it doesn't climb well, just not AS well).

shovelon · « **Reply #2 on:** December 04, 2005, 02:06:49 am »

You have a large 5000? With the carbon swingarm? If so, you have the 2 best frame geometries ever designed(biased here).

I would swap your long travel goodies to the 5000 and make the 3000 an XC lightweight.

For an example, I have been playing with putting my Oz featherweight goodies on my 957 and optimizing it's cockpit, and WOW. It is light and fast and my prefered ride. Sure it only has 3 inches front and rear, but WOW.

My OZ (same geometry as 5000) is getting cartridge bearings and will begin it's diet after Xmas.

Oh, take a look at K2perv's gallery. Yumm.

Terry

Frankd3000 · « **Reply #3 on:** December 04, 2005, 02:10:52 am »

Quote

Hard to compare the Attack to other frames because it only comes with crappy suspension, and not a lot of people have upgraded that one. I've ridden a Way Big, and it was heavy, the suspension sucked, but the handling was pretty smooth (maybe just because I felt like I was so high in the air...)

Which frame do you think the 5000 will be "pretty much the same thing" as? Certainly not one of the "strut" frames. BIG difference. The 5000 handles longer travel better, but probably doesn't climb as well (certainly not with a taller fork, but that doesn't mean it doesn't climb well, just not AS well).

Really?! Yes, the comparison was strut versus strut-less. I assumed that with such a similar pivot that most characteristics would be the same. Handling shouldn't be affected too much, with a similar wheelbase. Ride would be different, but as you stated - better at big hits, poorer climber.

Not what i'm looking for, so no build.

Yes, a better shock would be a must, at least for me. Any idea what the i2i is on them?

shovelon · « **Reply #4 on:** December 04, 2005, 02:29:49 am »

Ok, the pivots are similar but certainly not the same. ProflexK2 lowered the pivot on your 5000 to a more active travel. The 5000 has the potential to climb even better than the 57s(with propedal, for example).

The 57s in my opinion are a bit too agressive in the dig-in. So to offset, I use only light semislicks, because they really bite under pedaling as opposed to the 5000. The 5000 frame, I use a more agressive(and heavier) tire.

Got any Pics of the 5000 frame? I2I is 8.25 stock on the 5000.

shovelon · « **Reply #5 on:** December 04, 2005, 02:45:57 am »

Andrew, $100 to Canada! Do it!

I want to go after it meself! [smiley=laughing.gif]

Terry

Frankd3000 · « **Reply #6 on:** December 04, 2005, 12:12:01 pm »

What link did you erase Terry? $100 to Canada? C'mon now, share. If it's the yellow Attack on E-Bay I saw it. Or did I miss something else?

Ummm, not sure what i'm going to do right now. Just got some very disturbing news. Back in a day or two. Apparently K2/ProFlex don't know how to use measuring tools worth a crap!

(insert crying Smiley here)

shovelon · « **Reply #7 on:** December 04, 2005, 02:43:01 pm »

Lithium size large, currently $250
http://cgi.ebay.com/2005-K2-Lithium-3-0-Large-NR_W0QQitemZ7201565406QQcategoryZ98083QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Shipping $100 to Canada

jazclrint · « **Reply #8 on:** December 04, 2005, 02:46:52 pm »

FD3K,
As others have said the pivots are close but different. ProFlex moved the pivot point for less dig in while in the granny gear and also less pedal induced bob. I personally like the extra dig in on the often wet and slippersy climbs here in the Maine series. But, the guy I bought my 5500 frame from said it was an out standing climber, and he could actually cleans climbs with it that he hadn't been able to before, and that others couldn't. He sold the frame set to because he had just bought an Ellsworth XC frameset that was supposed to be better. Well, it didn't turn out significantly lighter, and didn't climb as well either! he almost didn't sell the 5500 frameset to me, but his wife would have killed him.

As far as I'm concerned the X57s and X000/X500s were the best frames ProFlex/K2 came out with, and everything that follwed maybe good, but just not as good. You could put the same shock set up on your 5000 that I have on my 5500 (if I ever find the drawings, or get my bike back to measure them up) as I did. I say build the 5000, you'll be happier in the end. But I'm biased.
Rich

Frankd3000 · « **Reply #9 on:** December 04, 2005, 03:33:06 pm »

Terry - yeah, but that's a whole bike. I just can't afford that. By the time it's won it'll be over $600. Thanks for the find all the same!

Rich - it just might happen yet. I'm gonna take some measurements and such and see. I've got nearly another bike in parts anyways. [smiley=laughing.gif]

shovelon · « **Reply #10 on:** December 05, 2005, 02:52:54 am »

Andrew(FD3K [smiley=laughing.gif])

You are probably right, but it is still at $250.

So Quetoo [smiley=laughing.gif] can't measure? Measure what?

Terry

Frankd3000 · « **Reply #11 on:** December 05, 2005, 08:47:50 am »

Quote

Andrew(FD3K [smiley=laughing.gif])

You are probably right, but it is still at $250.

So Quetoo [smiley=laughing.gif] can't measure? Measure what?

Terry

Hey, cool, I dig the abbr'v. [smiley=laughing.gif]

I'll keep an Ionit.

(not too bad, if i do say so myself)

Measure.... well... (sigh) I gotta rant a little. I hate doing it, but....

For many years I watched as MANY manufacturers down-right lied about their bikes. Weight, travel - you name it, one or another have lied in their advertising about any and every part on a bike. I thought K2 was beyond that. Probably some form of pipe-dream on MY part, but nonetheless, I thought wrong.

I had the opportunity to really measure Frank's rwt and shock/s'arm ratio last night. With the stock shock measuring in at 35mm travel the s'arm moves 57mm. Yeah, right guys, 57mm is "3.5 inches travel" - whatever you say. The ratio is really 1.65:1.

No wonder I had such a hard time tuning a C9 on there! It's even more embaressing as I check this earlier this year and didn't catch it (THAT ticks me off).

Anyways, is it a BIG deal? No, ultimately it's not. I at least KNOW what i'm dealing with and had I known this I never would have bought the forks I have now, nor would I have converted Frank to disk brakes. Those parts might be going onto the 5000.

Frank might very well be going the route that you are, Terry. V's, little travel and little weight. The 5000 will get "the big stuff".

Do I love Frank any less? Absolutely not! I still had awesome rides through this year and will continue to do so. That's what it's all about, right?

Anyways, what the heck were we talking about? [smiley=laughing.gif]

Oh yeah. Nevermind the Attack Q's, guys. I'm sure it one has a couple of inches of travel ANYWAYS.

/rant (and apologies to all for my behavior, just frustrated when my time and money are wasted like this)

off to spend more money,
Andrew

Simon · « **Reply #12 on:** December 05, 2005, 08:58:48 am »

Andrew.

One question

if as you say Frank is an awesome ride (which I can totally believe) why are you considering tearing it down to build up the 5000 or have I just got the wrong end of the stick here

would it not pay to take abit longer building up the 5000 (funds allowing) and have 2 bikes

agree about the manufactures lets say exaggerated claims,you really have to do your research to get to the truth sometimes.

Simon.

Frankd3000 · « **Reply #13 on:** December 05, 2005, 09:16:33 am »

Huh? No no no. Frank is being converted to a lighter trim. I'm NOT abandoning him!!!!! Fits waaaaaaaaay too good. He stay's - main ride.

I can't justify having the Minute up front, adding weight, then needing discs and disc wheels (more weight) for him. There's about 2.5-3 pounds of unnecessity there. I really think i'd be much happier if he was more like stock. V's, CrossLink, twin C9's. Why the heck do I need a fork with 4-5" travel when the rear is barely 3"?

The Minute, discs and wheels will all go towards the 5000. Like I said, i've practically got another bike alone in parts. Like you said, I certainly won't be in a rush to get it going. I don't need a lot to complete it.

It's all "might" right now, but the more I think about it the more I like that plan. I think Terry has the "best of both frame's", so to speak. [smiley=nod.gif]

Exagerrate? Mmmmm, okay, if YOU want to call it that then go ahead, but in my books it's false advertisement and that's lying. (maybe that's why Red5 got ticked and "left"?)

Anyways, enough about that. If this plan goes through Frank should be in the 25.x pound range for next year. I like the idea of the 3K/5K split. [smiley=laughing.gif]

will · « **Reply #14 on:** December 05, 2005, 01:00:19 pm »

Andrew...

If I remember right you're under 200#? If you plan to stick with disks on Frank, I should send you my Vector EXP forks with the disk mounts. (I just "won" a set of Noleen Mega Air's on ebay... $36! [smiley=nod.gif])

If you're going with V-brakes, it looks like ediscount bikes is still selling some EXP's on ebay. I've even seen some really loooong ones for you. They're selling for way cheap, too. $50 - $100.
Go man go.

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Author Topic: x57 versus Attack (Read 4995 times)

will