Agree or not?? Please comment.

[Irby]

I would buy another K2 bike IF they make a single pivot frame. I can buy any number of bikes that operate like the Tirade (Kona Dawg, SBC Epic, Trek Liquid, Giant NRS air for example), but very few affordable bikes offer the simplicicy of a monopivot design. OP once stated that not all techno advances are true improvements. I agree, and would argue that the single pivot design is a great way to go given the development of high quality damping shocks. Ellsworth makes the ISIS frame, but who the heck can afford such a rig on a family budget? I was deeply hoping that the new line of K2 offerings would include an updated EVO bike, but I have yet to see any such design. In my opinion, K2 has yet to come out with a bike that meets or exceeds the performance/price criteria of the EVO. Girvin definately broke the mold with the 856/756 and K2 went on to supply superior value with the 1999 EVO technology and beyond with the subsequent 2000-2003 morphs of the EVO.  Give us a 5 inch travel, updated 30 pound EVO with new shock technology for under 1500 dollars and you'll have a winner on your hands once again. My two cents. Dan

[numbnuts]

I think K2 should have kept the Evo around, but probably didn't realise what was happening with shock technology or maybe thought a 4-bar would be more economical than single pivot with the new pricey shocks. My evo is my first FS, I'm real happy with it how it's set up and will consider buying another if the price is right. But after hearing and reading reviews and comments, I would buy a proper 4 bar design now if I was in the market and had the dosh, ie specialized.Anyway, Let's see what the Lithium does, I haven't seen the review or any pics yet, but hope it's a winner.

[Carbon_Angus]

the EVO was probably one of the best true mono-pivot frames made. the Oz frame being the sexiest ( :-*IMHO )

the world cup / strut frame is a great short (now) travel bike for XC

but these new bikes are just plain better, there are fewer glaring tradeoffs, the new shocks are valved and designed for these frames, etc.

mono pivots have evolved as far as they will with the Turner Maverick

[Old Proflexer]

got a chance to ride my neighbor's (Bob - and I hope we all remember Bob) new santa cruz blur -

maybe i'm just a little dense (don't all jump in here and agree with me) but i can't see spending that kind of money for the same kind of travel and same kind of feel and experience that i get on my carbons with a $200 used psylo sl on the front and an upgraded shock on the back end.

my travel is longer and smoother and most importantly, set up properly to function fully.  

"AND THE BIKES FEEL BASICALLY THE SAME!
(sorry, dont mean to yell)
EVEN WITH HIS VIRTUAL PIVOT POINT TECHNOLOGY!"  
what's that all about anyway?

Bob, is a typical rider who now, after years of frustration, does a lot of his own minor bike maintainence, cleaning, repairs etc.  He's had that bike for a couple of months now and still doesn't have it dialed in for himself, nor does he really know, how - he's lost for the most part, can't figure out how to effectively utilize all the knobs and dials on the fox fork, forgets to use them in a variety of situations on the ride, fiddles with the air in the 5th element air shock but hasn't a clue even after reading the manual and a variety of published articles and has never touched that rebound dial on the 5th for fear of messing things up.  His new pedals are a bit of a mystery on how to adjust the tension and what screws do what.  
i at least made sure his brakes work so he doesn't kill himself.

Many, many people spend major dollars on new technology only to have a bike shop set things up and the rider will just have to get used to it, good bad or ugly.  and sometimes good, bad and ugly is just that, high tech, out of kilter, screwed up and no where near as good as simple, properly lubed and fully functional.   [smiley=furious.gif]
but it could be if set up a properly and regularly tweaked to stay that way.

oh well - i do hope all the millions of riders out there with the latest and greatest take full advantage of what they have.  after i set up Bob's bike to my personal specs - i preferred the ride of my 97 production, properly adjusted, slighly upgraded,  monopivot carbon.  while others are out chasing their dreams with the lastest in marketing induced, technopsychobabble componentry and how it makes a wheel move up and down in relation to the frame -

i'll be just a ridin and a smilin

OP  

[drtunit]

I ride a 5-year-old 957. It now has a lot of miles on it and little or no resale value thanks to K2 whoring out the old stuff. Sure I want all of the newest gizmos and I have checked out a few but on most of the test rides, my bike works just as well for my style of riding, is simpler and lighter. In the last 5 years, I put a fox float on and spent some $ on regular routine maintenance-and how did I spend the thousands of $ I saved by not buying into the marketing hype attached to the newest chi-chi's from overseas? 1 trip to Moab, a few to Sedona, Mammoth, Big Bear, Durango, Santa Fe...in the end, is it the bike or the ride?

[Phillip]

OP,
This is getting off topic, but I see a lot of "Bob"s out there. The parking lot at my local grocery store always has a few H2 Hummers with "Bob" s at the helm. I have never seen one with dirt or sratches. I bet 99.9% of those Hummer Jockeys don't have a clue about their venicles' technology, just like your neighbor and his Blur. At least he didn't drop $55K on a toy he doesn't understand!  

[Simon]

More than happy with my single pivot Oz,also is not the new lithium single pivot, it doesn't appear to have a horst link so is not a true 4 bar system just the shock is compressed by a linkage thats all(I know theres more than 1 pivot but its still effectivly a single pivot application),conventional single pivot is still alive and well, Orange (2yr and currant world cup DH champions) are all single pivot within there range,Scott strike 03,some Marin's,Cannondale's to name a few still have conventional single pivots in there range.Simon

[Carbon_Angus]

More than happy with my single pivot Oz,also is not the new lithium single pivot, it doesn't appear to have a horst link so is not a true 4 bar system just the shock is compressed by a linkage thats all(I know theres more than 1 pivot but its still effectivly a single pivot application),conventional single pivot is still alive and well, Orange (2yr and currant world cup DH champions) are all single pivot within there range,Scott strike 03,some Marin's,Cannondale's to name a few still have conventional single pivots in there range.Simon

here's something that i found....about suspension.
i just think the more advanced designs go up..and down.. better than the mono pivot EVO frame. the rides are different and better all around on the newer designs.


http://www.titusti.com/techtalk.html#Horst_Link

[jimbo]

The only thing I would change on a "New Evo" is ability to use conventional shock sizes without altering geometry and bigger tire clearance in the rear.

[Simon]

here's something that i found....about suspension.
i just think the more advanced designs go up..and down.. better than the mono pivot EVO frame. the rides are different and better all around on the newer designs.


http://www.titusti.com/techtalk.html#Horst_Link

Interesting but doesn't detail VPP though,read some indepth articles on that, gets very complicated,in the end no matter what the manufactures say or claim its down to us who ride them as to what we actually like,whats great for some may not suit someone else,as long as there are options out there to try I'm happy,how boring it would be if thay all came up and marketed the same option,thats the beauty of engineering theres always another way,Simon

[Gordo]

If you are looking for an afordable single pivot you might want to check out the Haro Extreme line of FS bikes. The new ones look pretty good and they cheap with good parts. A buddy of mine had a older one that was very tough.

[pedro]

I own a horst link/(especialized?) suspended bike. I was frustrated with the main pivot coming loose.  Its suspension performance, out of a fox float, was only good for racing, and it only had less than 3" travel in the rear.

I decided I wanted a new suspension experience. I figured a single pivot design should work better on my trails, so I got an evo frame which I built up with a mixture of old and new parts.  The evo with the stock shock produced over 4" of travel. The extra travel was enough for me to be impressed over my older ride. The frame has a few.........quirks, but with this site's help, it is working excellent for me.  I replaced the stock shock with a fox vanilla, and now get 5.4" of rear travel. The evo is confortable and very good for gnarly trails..

Recently, I got an old (but not used) fox vanilla X and put it on my FSR type bike. The van x is a bit longer, almost 7" itoi and with a bit longer stroke 1.75 (the float was 6.5 itoi and 1.5 stroke). I have been riding the FSR and have been very impressed with the rear's performance. The travel is now 3.5".  The FSR's rear suspension  works very smooth.  It appears not to be working as much as the forward single pivot suspended bike, but on the saddle you feel it smoothing out the terrain.

I beleive different trails are better suited for different suspension designs, and like the idea of having two or more bikes with different suspension designs around. Whenever I am getting bore with a bike's performance I start riding the other bike.  I even keep a hardtail around which I ride from time to time.  After riding the hardtail, the suspension bikes seem great.