Author Topic: Lightest spring for a Stratos... (Read 5968 times)

Matno · « **on:** February 12, 2003, 08:39:46 am »

I'm back in the spring market for my Helix Pro again. I still want a slightly more plush ride on the small stuff. It's certainly not bad as is, but I would prefer it softer. I'm just curious, a while back a few people were discussing getting/riding lighter springs. I'm thinking 400# or possibly lighter.

I've currently got a 400# on there, but it's not a Stratos Progressive spring, and I think a Stratos spring will give me the lighter spring weight I want in the first part of the travel without bottoming out. (I originally had a 500# Stratos and switched to the 400 to increase my travel because I wasn't getting full compression).

I know at least one person had a 350# and another had a 300# on their Helixes. Any feedback on how those lighter springs work would be appreciated. (For what it's worth, I weigh 140+).

GaryF52 · « **Reply #1 on:** February 12, 2003, 09:58:27 am »

My Helix Expert came with a Stratos 300 X 2.6 spring. It feel fine for me. I weigh about 163lbs. I'm still experimenting with the air pressure and rebound settings but right now 140lbs. air and the third slowest rebound setting feels darn nice for my xc riding style.

I think you'd probably be fine with a 300 lb. spring, maybe even lighter.

GrimJack · « **Reply #2 on:** February 12, 2003, 10:52:48 am »

Seems like a progressively wound spring for a stratos would be overkill - there is already a built in progressiveness with the air chamber in those.

The air spring assist on those will also allow you to run a lighter spring than normal, and just use air pressure to make up the difference.

Remeber to check a local machine shop that winds springs for a price on a custom wound coil before you buy one from a bike shop. Where I live, this seems to be the cheaper method, and nets you a higher quality spring, too.

Matno · « **Reply #3 on:** February 12, 2003, 01:02:16 pm »

I think Stratos makes their springs progressive for a reason. Even if the bottoming protection of the air chamber is there, the progressive springs seem to get better reviews.

Gary, I wonder if that means your stroke length is longer than mine. My Stratos originally came with a 500 x 2.1 spring (I've got a 2.4 on there now). Not that I need (or want) more travel, just curious. As for a lighter spring, Stratos told me the lightest they had was a 400. I wonder if they were just low on stock at the time, or if they don't make a lighter spring in my size shock. (My original spring's unsprung length was 120mm). A 300 lb spring does seem rather light for you. Can you tell when the air spring "kicks in"? (Supposedly it doesn't do anything until the final 1/3 of travel). If it works for you, it sounds like it might work for me too. Do you ever bottom out? Do you do any drops? (I occasionally drop 2-3 feet and don't want to bottom out harshly). Maybe I'm asking too much.

Now about the machine shop idea. I'm sure that there are tons of them around, but finding something like that here in NYC is next to impossible. I wasted 2 days trying to find a place to buy aluminum for my brake adaptor. Finally called Utah (where I was going to be a week later) and found 2 places in 3 calls. (The first place didn't have it but directed me to the other two. People out west are so much more friendly and helpful than they are here!) In case I do try to do that (I can't imagine they would be much cheaper than the $40 Stratos charges), do you have any tips about what to ask for? I'm not sure about the spring diameter, but I know it's fairly standard between different brands of shocks, isn't it? The unsprung length is 120mm and I want it coiled progressively (start @ 300#, end at 400 I think would be ideal). Stroke length should be 54mm. Anything else I need to specify?

Sheesh. Why do my posts always turn out so LONG?!

GaryF52 · « **Reply #4 on:** February 12, 2003, 03:06:35 pm »

Matno,
I bought my shock used, so I don't know the spec on it, but it came on a late model Disco Monkey frame so I'm guessing it was spec'd for that bike. I think a Helix Expert may run a little longer stroke than the Pro of the same i2i length.
I couldn't really say when the air spring 'kicks in'. Haven't had the shock for very long. It is pretty sensitive to changes in the air pressure. At 130 lbs it was super soft with lots of sag to the point where steering on steep climbs degraded slightly. At 160 lbs. it was still fairly plush but I had to crank up the rebound damping all the way.
Did some small jumps (like a foot or 2) last week and the shock performed great, but I'm basically a XC rider and I don't take to the air that much. There is a ditch that I regularly cross at full speed that always would bottom out my smart shock, but it's much smoother with the Stratos.
Some say that you're getting the most from your suspension when it just bottoms out on the biggest stuff you do.
Also, check the shock manual on Stratos web site. It has a list of their springs, if you can figure out the cryptic model numbers.
Cheers.

GrimJack · « **Reply #5 on:** February 12, 2003, 04:58:34 pm »

The air chamber definitely works throughout the stroke, not just on one bit - I lost all the air pressure in mine once (the valve loosened just enough on the trail) and did I ever notice the difference!

The stroke on the Expert *is* a touch longer than the Pro.

The dimensions you'll need to get a spring wound are:
- inner diameter
- stroke
- length
- spring rate

Seems odd that it's more difficult to find things in NYC!

Matno · « **Reply #6 on:** February 12, 2003, 10:35:13 pm »

Thanks. NYC is an anomaly. We have everything, but it seems that most places are so small and specialized that you can never find quite what you want. It's annoying. I'll give it a try though, just to see what happens...

slowride · « **Reply #7 on:** February 13, 2003, 07:05:46 am »

Hey Matno, I have a couple friends who springs through here:

http://www.pohlsprings.com/

Dunno how much it cost, but it's something to investigate...

Matno · « **Reply #8 on:** February 13, 2003, 08:05:54 am »

Anybody know the inner diameter of Stratos springs? The first guy I emailed suggested I just get one from Stratos because they have a unique inner diameter. I was under the impression that it was the same as other manufacturers...

GrimJack · « **Reply #9 on:** February 14, 2003, 08:45:21 pm »

Don't you already have a stratos? Just yank it off and measure it!

I have one here on a frame, I could yank that one if it'll help.

The measurement doen't need to be accurate to any huge degree, just to a millimeter or so. Bigger is better than smaller in this case.

Matno · « **Reply #10 on:** February 14, 2003, 10:09:53 pm »

Dave, thanks for your offer, I may take you up on it.

The spring I have on there now is too long. Therefore, once it comes off, it is staying off, so I don't really want to take it off until I have a new one! (It was a royal pain in the rear to get it on. Trying to compress a spring and slide the retainer clip on at the same time is NOT easy. If anybody knows any tricks for this, I'd appreciate it. If not, I'll probably just email Stratos and ask them.

GrimJack · « **Reply #11 on:** February 16, 2003, 02:12:50 pm »

Actually, I have a trick for that. Just head down to a mechanic shop that does suspension and get them to use their spring compressor on it. Works great.

Matno · « **Reply #12 on:** February 17, 2003, 02:04:24 am »

Great. Another easy solution that requires me to find a shop that does suspension and will be nice enough to take my spring off without charging me their "minimum service fee" of $45...

People around here who are willing to help out just to be nice are hard to find. Not that they don't exist, but it helps if you have connections, and I don't... :-/

slowride · « **Reply #13 on:** February 17, 2003, 04:38:48 am »

I don't know if this would be true in your area, but here in Chicago, you can go to an auto parts store (like Murray's Discount Auto or Pep Boys) and borrow a spring compressor for free. You just have to put down a deposit to cover the tool in case you don't bring it back, and you get the deposit back when you do.

Matno · « **Reply #14 on:** February 17, 2003, 05:34:57 am »

Now we're talking! I've got a Pep Boys just around the corner. I think I'll give them a ring... Thanks for the tip.

By the way, how does it work? Is it a huge tool or a little one? Does it have to slip in between the end of the spring and the retaining clip or does it just grab the middle of the spring? Thanks.

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Author Topic: Lightest spring for a Stratos... (Read 5968 times)