K2 / Proflex Riders Group
General => Tech Forum => Topic started by: knottyknotty on March 24, 2009, 02:15:25 pm
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hi looking for airshock for my 5500
i would love a risse astro 5
but cant get in contact with them
anyone know of uk distributer
or can recommend any other rear air shock
with minimal modification
dont want to harm my baby
as an alternative does anyone know of a uk smartshock repairer
hope someone can help pls
knotty
liverpool uk
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Fox DHX is a nice choice. Manitou Swinger 3 way is my choice for my Oz.
I use Risse shocks. Probably they are busy with subcontracting right now. I think that the bike and motorcycle division is not paying the bills right now. I can make a phone call for you if you wish and let you know if they can still take care of you.
Other choices like Rockshox or marzochi can be used with an adapter crossblock which is what I use.
Whatever, keep that 5500 running.
Terry
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hi thanks for reply
do i need to modify to use fox
can you recomeend a uk supplier
if it wouldnt be to much trouble could you ring risse on my behalf
my email is knottyknotty@tiscali.co.uk
any more info regarding shock suppliers etc greatly appreciated
thanks so much for your help so far
itching to get up an running again summer coming
knotty
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hi found uk supplier for fox
firm called mojo
new question what length and stroke would i need
thxs
knotty
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i2i 209mm (you can go longer and run more sag)
stroke 1.75" min
Simon
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cheers simon
200x50 ] \
200x57 ] = ?????
215x64 ] /
easiest/best setup anyone?
thxs
knotty
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has to be 215 the others a a bit short
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Having measured the travel on my Oz (5500) frame without a shock, I believe that the limits of shock length between swing arm hit points are:
Max: 235mm (hit on derailleur post)
Min: 157mm (hit on frame vertical member)
So you're looking for a shock with a maximum I2I length of 235 and a minimum once you subtract the travel of more than 157mm.
I'm working on slightly safer limits of 160 to 230.
So, theoretically, the 215/64 infringes the minimum hit point by being 151mm long at full compression....................
I'm still trying to find the perfect air shock that fulfills those travel limits, increases the overall travel of the rear swingarm to at least 5" and doesn't need ANY mods to the frame.
If anyone knows of one............Post it here with photos!
Col.
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colin youve found the perfect air shock, you just havent got it......yet ;)
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For risse shocks try CVI.co.uk,they imported my rise shocks a good while back and there web site still seems live.
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CVI shut down in around April '07 (or was it '06?)... not sure about their website.
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Manitou Swinger spv air 230 x 70 .
230mm eye to eye
70 mm stroke, so closed length 160mm
How much rear travel would you get with an OZ with 70mm of shock stroke. IS it 1.9 : 1 ratio , I cant remember exactly.
Unfortunatly the lower mount will have to be modded , by filing down the side ramps, not by much mind.
My OZ is now sporting a rear disk ,and a set of 'ghettto ' tubesless Conti Vert Pro tyres.
Still 30lb 4oz tho
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Just FYI, Risse is in the process of moving right now. If you call the phone number listed on your site you're referred to the new number. Though my emails went unanswered, calling that second number put me in touch with a Risse rep immediately.
Hope this helps! I have an Astro 5 on my 4000...there seems to be an issue with mine, as it makes a loud squeak with each compression...but the motion is nice! Sending it back for a replacement or service.
- Doug
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Having measured the travel on my Oz (5500) frame without a shock, I believe that the limits of shock length between swing arm hit points are:
Max: 235mm (hit on derailleur post)
Min: 157mm (hit on frame vertical member)
So you're looking for a shock with a maximum I2I length of 235 and a minimum once you subtract the travel of more than 157mm.
I'm working on slightly safer limits of 160 to 230.
So, theoretically, the 215/64 infringes the minimum hit point by being 151mm long at full compression....................
I'm still trying to find the perfect air shock that fulfills those travel limits, increases the overall travel of the rear swingarm to at least 5" and doesn't need ANY mods to the frame.
If anyone knows of one............Post it here with photos!
Col.
I did fit a 215/64 Manitou swinger 4 way coil shock to my Oz early on. It was close but seemed not to hit. Of course I was limited by the bottom out bumper on the shaft. The ride was amazing, with lots of sag and maybe I never bottomed it out. No mods to the frame, only the spring cap, and would still be using it if not for the tonnage of it all.
Currently have a 200/57 Swinger Air 3way mounted with a crossblock at the bottom to increase i2i to 219mm. Me thinks it has 6" travel by using assuming a 2.7 to 1 ratio.
Terry
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thing with the swinger air 4 way is you can completely tune out any bottom out thanks to the adjustable spv, you can run it as plush as you like but with no chance of bottom out, imo its one of the best shocks out there, colin yours is being posted tomorow! ;D
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thing with the swinger air 4 way is you can completely tune out any bottom out thanks to the adjustable spv, you can run it as plush as you like but with no chance of bottom out, imo its one of the best shocks out there, colin yours is being posted tomorow! ;D
Good Man! that cheque won't bounce, honest! (I mean, if we can't trust the BANKS, then who can we trust?)
Col.
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(http://idriders.com/proflex/coppermine/albums/userpics/10008/normal_Fox_Float_Talas_Rear_Mounted.jpg)
usually only mods are to take a round file and cut into the mounting plate on the swingarm for the air valve -
lot of different shocks will work
OP
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yeh, shame we have to do even that, i.e. any mods to the bike at all
Col.
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I had only a few mods to do to fit this 4 way swinger, just ground down the top eye to fit it in nearly perfectly, only very minor filing down of the the mount plates. see image
(http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd144/jtolputt/DSCN3365.jpg)
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Did any of you have to fit new shim spacers to the shock to get it to fit snugly? The standard shims that came with the Noleen shocks are much thinner than the standard 12mm shims. Certainly, my RP23 (like OPs above) fitted directly because it is shipped with some machined shims but another shock I have does not have the shims out of the box.
I've just sent in an order to my machinist to make up shims to that a modern shock will fit the top bolt for a carbon frame snugly (without washers etc.). In case you're interested, I'm building up a set of parts to attach a fox RP23 type shock to any of the late proflex/K2 bikes.
if anyone wants one, let me know.
callum
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Hi Callum,
I'm not sure what you mean by "shims" ?
Do you mean the Bushes?
(http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Images/Models/Original/7466-1.jpg)
i.e. the pieces that fit in the shock eyes to adapt to the width of the shock mounting plates and correct bolt diameter for the bike?
Here's the standard NR-5 ones fitted to an Oz:
(http://idriders.com/proflex/coppermine/albums/userpics/10284/normal_IMG0004.JPG)
I find that you need a pair that space out to 37.2mm and fit a M6 bolt for the upper plates on an Oz.
and 23.8mm x M6 for the lower mounting.
I guess if you can't get a pair of bushes in these exact widths then you might need to use shims?
Colin.
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37.2mm? oh crap. I measured mine at 36mm and made the bush set 35.75mm wide (normal tolerance). however, my bike is a x500c (not sure if it is a 4 or a 5) and may be different to the later Oz frame. instead of using two halves - I went for the single unit with a left hand side cap.
Although, to be fair Colin's picture above shows a left and right bush set that would be a hell of a lot cheaper to make and also that's the arrangement on my Orange 5.
have made mental note that the carbon framed bikes are probably all different widths.
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i got the ones for the 4 way that i sold colin made by tftuned, they werent cheap either at £26 for the pair, i wouldnt mind but in my previous job i could have made them myself.
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GBP26 for a pair of bushes????
crikey. I'm planning to sell a line of CNC'd bushings and bolts so that folks can upgrade to a modern shock easily. will be cheaper than that though.
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37.2mm? oh crap. I measured mine at 36mm and made the bush set 35.75mm wide (normal tolerance). however, my bike is a x500c (not sure if it is a 4 or a 5) and may be different to the later Oz frame. instead of using two halves - I went for the single unit with a left hand side cap.
Although, to be fair Colin's picture above shows a left and right bush set that would be a hell of a lot cheaper to make and also that's the arrangement on my Orange 5.
have made mental note that the carbon framed bikes are probably all different widths.
I've just measured a Good condition blank carbon frame (that I think is a x500), a reasonably well used OzX and one of the last OzM's sold that is unridden (that I just happened to have lying around! <GRIN>)
The bushing width between the shock plates was:
x500 37.2mm
OzX 36.8mm
OzM 37.7mm
(using a digital Vernier)
Fortunately, the lower mount width on the swing arm was consistently 24mm
So, yes, the answer is they do vary, but it looks to me that the nominal "as designed" width is potentially 38mm.
36mm would be a bit skinny in my cases, but then you could always supply a couple of 0.25/0.5mm shims to take up the slack.
I guess that the plates can flex a bit and indeed , on a well used frame, maybe that is what has happened to cause the variation?
Out of interest, my 4000se upper width was 30mm and my XP-X was 31mm.
Col.
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now I see. I measured the bolt, not the gap. I imagine the carbon plates will bend in a bit when the bolt is tightened up.
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I've got 5 sets of bolts from my machine shop back for test in case anyone is interested. Will post pictures later on when I've tried them out. Is there a demand for kits to replace the old nr and smart shocks on carbon frames? The shocks seem to be wearing well.
I'm now working on the x57 bikes where there definitely is a demand because the nr shocks are failing now.
callum
rds
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I've got 5 sets of bolts from my machine shop back for test in case anyone is interested. Will post pictures later on when I've tried them out. Is there a demand for kits to replace the old nr and smart shocks on carbon frames? The shocks seem to be wearing well.
callum
rds
I am sure there will be. ;)
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here's some pictures from the loft this evening. The first one is a standard airshock that attached to the carbon frame:
(http://www.proflex.demon.co.uk/photos/855heads/CABolt_onOz.jpg)
It fits snugly on the top shock mounting, between the frame plates and the top bolt through the frame:
(http://www.proflex.demon.co.uk/photos/855heads/CABolt_onOz2.jpg)
I only had 5 made so they're still too expensive to be sold mainstream. I need some volunteers who are about to buy, or have got a Fox RP23, Swinger or any kind of modern air shock and can fit it to their carbon frame. This helps with measurements and instruction documents.
I have a fox rp23 that I will try this week.
callum
rds
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callum, when i sold u the frame and sent you the x-fusion shock did i leave the bushes in the shock? if i did it was me that turned them! know of any turning jobs going ;)
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I picked up my 5500? at the weekend & it has a 2008 Fox RP23 on it. I'll post photos of the mounts later, but am happy to trial your mount Callum.
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It won't let me post a pic again, just keep getting this message:
The upload folder is full. Please try a smaller file and/or contact an administrator.
File size is 81.5Kb
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yeah I'm trying to figure that one out - sorry about that - bear with me ::)
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callum, when i sold u the frame and sent you the x-fusion shock did i leave the bushes in the shock? if i did it was me that turned them! know of any turning jobs going ;)
the bushes weren't in there! that's why I made some!! if you have access to cnc, then get in touch. The raw prices were over 20 GBP (about 35 US dollars) per bushing set so it is still too expensive to sell - no ones going to pay that plus shipping for a tiny bushing set. I'm considering getting some specifically tuned RP23's and then throwing the bolts in. However, that will come when I've done the x57 RP23 kit.
callum
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I picked up my 5500? at the weekend & it has a 2008 Fox RP23 on it. I'll post photos of the mounts later, but am happy to trial your mount Callum.
you can always email the pics to me and I'll put them up. keen to work out whether the bushings where off the shelf or self made for your shock mounting!
callum
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callum thats odd thought id left the bushings on as i dont have them in my toolbox, wish i had access to a cnc machine at the moment as that would mean i had a job :(